AN NCS INTERVIEW: AGNETE MANGNES KIRKEVAAG (MADDER MORTEM)

photo by Camilla NessetKnut J. Berget

(Our old friend KevinP has rejoined us at NCS with a very special interview of Agnete M. Kirkevaag that we’re very happy to share with you now, about one month after the release of Madder Mortem‘s latest album [enthusiastically reviewed here by Andy Synn].)

It has been 8 years since we’ve last sat down with Agnete Mangnes Kirkevaag, lead vocalist of Norway’s Madder Mortem. An abundance of things have transpired in her life since that time; 2 full length albums and a documentary about the band have been released, coupled with personal loss, mental and physical transformation.

Please join me again as I delve into the psyche of an enlightened and articulate gem of a human being. We discuss the new album, Old Eyes, New Heat (released January 26, 2024 via Dark Essence Records), how growing up in Norway and cultural norms shaped her life, who we have to thank for the band’s existence, and her journey of acceptance and gratitude.

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K: The last time we sat down to do this was back in 2016 after Marrow was released. But I’m going to put you on the spot and see if you remember the very first time we ever spoke.

Agnete: I don’t know how long I’ve known you now but it’s getting to be quite a few years. It was around one of our albums, but I can’t remember which one. But I assume the conversation didn’t start with the Skolebolle at EPCOT!

 

K: It was in 2006 via an actual phone call, right after Desiderata came out. My lasting memory of that (no longer available online as that site is defunct) was being pleasantly surprised that the neuroses and eccentricities of New Yorkers in a scripted comedy resonated so well with stoic Norwegians. Of course, I’m referencing Seinfeld and Curb Your Enthusiasm.

Agnete: Yeah, we all love Seinfeld and Curb. I’ve had the same reaction from British people when we start talking about Monty Python; they’re surprised Norwegians love it so much.

 

K: I don’t see Jerry or Kramer adhering to the Law of Jante very well. I could see George giving it a try though.

Agnete: George is always struggling with it… particularly when others violate those rules, like Lloyd Braun, if you remember that episode?

 

K: Do I remember that episode? Who do you think you are talking to? I’m a living breathing walking Seinfeld episode, if I do declare!

Agnete: Same. I’ve watched the whole series so many times I know half of it by heart!

 

K: What are some of your favorite moments from both shows and was there anything that still puzzled you, confusing, or “too American” for a Nord to understand?

Agnete: One of my favorite episodes is the Merv Griffin show one – just very much the essentials of all the characters and the insanity coming together to create a very funny and bizarre whole. And the whole George and the Susan Ross Foundation story line is just beautiful. From Curb, one of the bits I remember best is when Larry’s pretending to be kosher, including pretending to speak Yiddish… really hurts to watch!

In general, it’s only product- or company-specific references that might pass me by. Most of the humor is based in character and personality, which is pretty much universal anyhow. And you pick up a lot of cultural references from TV and pop culture. We Nords watch a lot of English-language stuff.

 

K: I didn’t need any additional reasons to love you Madders more, but this is the proverbial icing on the cake. Since the last interview, a plethora of things have transpired in your world:

– Marrow full length released 2018
– Howl of the Underdogs documentary released, which coincided with your surgery 2019

I was very intrigued by The Law of Jante that was discussed in the documentary. Enlighten us brash rebellious Americans about exactly what this is and how it pervades society in Norway.

Agnete: The Law of Jante stems from the 1933 novel A Fugitive Crosses His Tracks by Aksel Sandemose. It’s a code of conduct named after the protagonist’s hometown and is a series of rules basically telling you not to stick your neck out in any way or think you’re special, with commandments like “You’re not to think you are anything special” or “You’re not to think you are good at anything”.

The Jante Law has become more or less a proverb, especially in the Scandinavian countries, and to quote Wikipedia (since they’ve described it very succinctly), “is now used colloquially to denote a social attitude of disapproval towards expressions of individuality and personal success”.

In our part of Norway, this kind of mentality has always been part of the culture. I think the best suggestion I got as to why, was from one of the people we interviewed for our Howl movie. His theory was that in a very, very poor area, where many were smallholders whose entire livelihood depended on the goodwill of the estate owners, solidarity between the poor was very strong and provided a security net to prevent anyone from going under. But at the same time, that security net was threatened by anyone who tried to rise above.

 

photo by Andrea Chirulescu

 

K: How would you say this affected your upbringing? And did this cause a clash of sorts when exposed to the world outside of your home?

Agnete: Hmm… I think what caused some trouble for me, was that in some ways, I was a little different. I learned to read and write very early (growing up with avid readers for parents and a teacher mom), and schoolwork was always very easy for me, so I was way ahead of my class in most subjects in primary school. My interests were bookish and nerdy, I was most definitely not cool in any way and a chubby kid as well. I was special, but the social code dictated that you should be careful not to show that too much in case you hurt others’ feelings.

At the same time, the shooting range was open 24-7 for anyone who wanted to take a shot at my strangeness, my body shape, or my old-fashioned clothes. I was left with no defense, really. Having come from a very loving family and a wonderful childhood, entering adolescence and the world of the junior high school hierarchy was brutal.

As an adult, some aspects of this have stuck with me. I have a hard time accepting a compliment or being satisfied with my own contribution or accomplishments unless they’re way beyond the expected. I set the bar at a wildly different height for myself than for others. If I’m not consciously aware of it, I tend to downplay my talents and skills to seem more “normal”, and I tend to put the needs of others before my own to an extent that is not healthy.

As for clashing with the world outside, what has been most difficult for the band is that the Jante mentality means you absolutely suck at selling yourself. We’re so extremely bad at the promotional side of music – you know, networking, pushing for contacts and gigs, angling for opportunities. and so on. Our way, what’s bred in our bones, is to do a hell of a good job and let people discover that for themselves, which is a very bad strategy in an overcrowded music market.

I think that what we do, is pretty F’in unique. But when people praise our albums, for instance, if I don’t consciously craft my answers differently, my answer is “Thank you – we really enjoy playing.” And that is such a lie. We don’t “enjoy playing music”. We’ve set our whole lives to that target, giving that priority over everything else, and worked defiantly towards the goal of making better music for 30 years now, and we’re very, very good at it.

 

K: I appreciate your candor and honesty. That is quite a bit to unpack, so let’s do that.

One of the main points of the Howl of the Underdogs documentary (released in 2021) was your weight-loss surgery in 2019. As you mentioned in the film, you had an eating disorder since you were 13, and struggled with your perception that you were holding the band back by not “looking the part”, while feeling guilt that you even let this bother you at all, as if you were causing the band to shoulder this burden with you. Fast forward 5 years later and here we are today.

How are you feeling physically, but more importantly, mentally?

Agnete: Physically I’m probably in the best shape I’ve ever been in my life. Being half the weight makes a lot of practical things so much easier, and you can do so much more – it is half the workload, after all. After my surgery, I was extremely disciplined, very strict with my daily regime and followed the recommendations I got to the letter, and as a result, I’ve had very few side effects or problems. I just went for the 5-year check-up, and everything is in very good order, bloodwork like a teenager again.

Mentally, that is naturally a more complex question. I’ll get back to where my mind is at these days, but it’s very important to me to stress how interconnected your physiological and psychological states are. If your body isn’t working like it should, it naturally makes you feel like crap because you might be afraid, or disappointed in yourself, or feel low self-worth. But it also makes you feel like crap because your thought processes are directly influenced by your hormones, your vitamin and mineral blood levels, your blood pressure, etc. A simple example is how exercise releases all-natural goodie drugs in your brain. If you have issues that makes exercise difficult, you can’t get those brain-made feel-good drugs either and that feeds further into a downward spiral.

How am I feeling these days? After the surgery, the first year was a bit of a headrush. Losing all that weight was such an ecstatic feeling, and such a lot was happening with the band as well, so it felt like starting a new life. But I think when the “I’m fat” weight on my shoulders was lifted, that meant I had to start dealing with a lot of other related or underlying issues. I also ran into some huge disappointments in other areas of my life and found myself in a very dark place. There was just no future I could imagine for myself that I actually wanted to have, leaving “only bleak and lifeless duty,” basically.

A lot of that is woven into the new album for me, that endless sorrow. I was starting to force myself out of that darkness when Dad died in spring 2023. As devastating as that was, strangely enough, it was also a turning point for the better. I could put down all the worry I had been carrying for Dad, and I used that energy to make some much-needed changes in my circumstances.

Sometimes life gives you unexpected blessings, too. I met my boyfriend in spring 2023, I went back to full-time work in August, we finished the album around the same time, and so the last year has been a slow and steady improvement for me. It’s not all butterflies and sunshine, of course, but the baseline these days is that I’m ok, which is pretty good for me, and then there are quite a few days where I’m happy and satisfied with life.

 

photo by Camilla NessetKnut J. Berget

 

K: Wonderful to hear that things have improved and on the “up and up,” which makes me happy for you.

We are of similar age (I have a few years on you though kiddo!) and you do come to realize that life really is a roller coaster. I think we all subconsciously know this as human beings but maybe don’t give it too much thought in our youth. But as life goes on you learn to accept that there is going to be pain, heartaches, and challenges to overcome. Without that, the calm or “high moments” have far less meaning/impact.

So, have you come to accept some of the past demons or “darkness” as typical of being a human, and hopefully that gives you less regret over all the times you beat yourself up over it?

Agnete: To a certain extent, I guess. But I think that also quite a lot of that darkness is part of my personality. It’s a bit of a cliché but nonetheless true. Quite a lot of people with a strong artistic drive are what I think nowadays called ‘highly sensitive’. As I see that cluster of traits in myself, it’s simply that I’m very, very aware of my environment and my thoughts at all times and I experience everything intensely. A little further out on that scale and we’re getting close to the traits you’d find in people on the spectrum. I’ve never had any difficulties understanding or interpreting emotions or subtext, but I can definitely recognize the tendency to hyperfocus, or über-procrastination on routine tasks, and most of all, the intensity of emotion.

Having this kind of personality is both a blessing and a curse. The highs are very high, and the lows are proportionally abyssal. I care very, very much for the people in my life, which amongst other things means that my friendships are long-lasting, and I feel like I have a very tightly knit network, but that trait also leaves me very vulnerable in a romantic context.

That intensity is also one of the main reasons I’m a good musician, I think. My main concern in music is usually conveying the emotional content and that is obviously easier when your emotions are strong and clear. My mind is never at rest, which can be very difficult to deal with on a bad day, but it’s also a great tool when it comes to writing, because I can work on multiple planes of something at the same time, as in both details and overview, like quickly evaluating how a transition between two riffs may affect the song structure as a whole.

I don’t know that there is a lot of regret. There is quite a bit of sorrow that things had to be the way they were and a lot of empathy for a younger me that didn’t have the tools I have now to stand up for myself and set my own boundaries more clearly.

 

K: What I’ve always enjoyed about talking to you has been, I have to stop and think about my next follow-up question, or at least alter it a bunch to either reflect on what you said, or you’ve already answered the next two or three questions. It’s a nice problem to have, truth be told.

I absolutely agree with you, I prefer having the highest of highs, knowing full well that even when you regress to the mean (aka – come back to normal) it still feels like a big deviation/adjustment.

But let me back up a bit. The new album, Old Eyes, New Heart was written/recorded between May 2021 – Feb 2022 and just released last month, January 2024. Right in the middle of this, yours and BP’s father, Jakob, passed away in February 2023.

I want to give you the time to share with everyone about Dad and his influence on not only you, but Madder Mortem.

 

Jakob (photo by Ann-Helen Moen Nannestad)

 

Agnete: Where to begin? I mean, Dad was such an exceptional human being. He had such a lust for life and was always curious about the world and new things, all the way up until the end. When things got difficult in life, BP and I knew that Dad would always be there, no matter what, always unconditional in his love and support. There was never any doubt that we were his first priority, even when Mom and he divorced, and we lived with Mom for some years. He was always just a phone call away. He was the kind of person who you knew you could call at any time, no matter where he was or what he was doing, and if you needed his help, he’d get in his car and come to be there for you. I know how privileged we have been, that most people have much more complicated relationships with their parents. But Dad was special. He lived with me for the last 10 years of his life, and I think it says something that sharing a house was mostly no problem for all that time.

For the Madders, I’m not sure we would have been doing what we do if not for Dad. One aspect of that is how we grew up with a Dad who shared his immense love for music with us, playing loads of classical and pop/rock music and dancing around the house. He was a die-hard Bach fan, blasting Toccata und Fuge in D minor as loud as the stereo would go, he always turned up the volume far more than BP or I ever did. That inherited love for baroque music is very easy to trace in Madder songwriting, especially in how we layer things sometimes. He was like that with literature too, the house was full of books and both he and Mom read for us for hours and hours. Growing up in that environment really stimulated our creativity and love for art.

When we started playing music, he was always interested and supportive, even though I imagine my school band concerts weren’t that fantastic to listen to. He got BP his first guitar, I think Dad and Mom chipped in together to get his first drum kit. As we got into bands, and eventually started Mystery Tribe (1993-1997), he was so enthusiastic and into it. I mean, just the hours of driving to and from rehearsals, and enduring rehearsals in the house. He chipped in on half the cost of our CD demo, the one that got us signed to Misanthropy Records. We’ve always rehearsed mostly on weekends, and he’d have the whole band staying in the house, cooking us dinner after rehearsal. And the big thing is I honestly think he enjoyed it. Our house was always open to our friends, and he became sort of a “group Dad” for all of us, because you could always talk to him about anything, and he was never judgmental or talked down to us.

And he was so very clearly intensely proud of what we were doing. He came to our shows whenever it was at all possible, even visiting us on both of our first tours. He was very proud that we did our own thing, followed our artistic vision and worked on our music without giving up. Where I think a lot of parents would have questioned the amount of money and time spent on the band, maybe wishing their kids to have financial stability and a more traditional life path, he always told us to pursue music. But most of all, I think he was proud of the music we made. He listened to our albums a lot, always loudly, and especially when he painted. He loved drawing the comparison between a church organ on full blast and the wall of distorted guitars we sometimes make.

As he was growing older, he often found people his own age boring, and loved hanging out with us and our friends. He was a funny guy too, loved telling stories, but he was also very, very good at making people feel welcome and at ease. I think one of my biggest regrets, when it comes to Dad, was seeing how difficult it was for him when I was at my darkest, how sorry he was when he didn’t know how to make it better for me, how much he wanted to figure out something to do to fix things. I miss him so much.

 

K: Absolutely beautiful. Brings a smile to my face and a tear to my eye to hear this. I’ll never tell someone it will minimize the pain of the loss, but I try and live by the adage: Gratitude makes sense of our past, brings peace for today, and creates a vision for tomorrow. While maybe not a direct correlation, it makes me feel thankful this person was in my life and I had the good fortune to share these experiences with them. Much easier said than done of course.

Agnete: I agree – and that gratitude comes very easily when it comes to Dad. He’ll always be such a huge part of who we are and what we do.

 

album art by Jakob Kirkevaag & Costin Chioreanu

 

K: Dad’s artwork is featured on the new album.

Agnete: I’m so glad we could make the cover art happen. The whole band agreed that it would be so right to have him do the artwork, so we asked if he would paint something. He’d heard all the demo recordings in all stages of development, though he never got to hear the last and final mix. When we asked, he jumped to it enthusiastically. He did a whole range of paintings and invited BP and I to his studio to choose. There were a lot of really cool options, but we thought the sibling paintings that make up the front and back cover were just right for both the duality of the album and the slightly cool/chilly feel of the production. But we’ve also used some symbols and excerpts from some of the other paintings on our new stage design and merch.

It was also really cool that Costin Chioreanu could do the adaptation and graphic design. Costin stayed with us when we did the “Liberator” video (from 2018’s Marrow LP), he and Dad really hit it off. They stayed up late, drinking wine and talking about art. Dad loved Costin’s art, so it felt especially good to have his paintings adapted by someone who knew and respected him.

In a perfect world, Dad would have lived to see the finished album with his art on. But he knew that it was going to happen, and he was so happy about that. It feels like the perfect way to honor his memory.

 

Costin (photo by Olivia Chioreanu)

 

K: Mads (drums) has been on every album (except the debut) and I want to give him his ‘just due.’ And maybe it’s just me, but between Marrow and the new album I’m like “man, this guy is good”. And it’s more of just a feel and his use of rhythm and space that speaks to me. Case in point “Stumble On” (off Marrow) and all over the place on Old Eyes, New Heart.

Agnete: I agree – he deserves a lot more attention than he often gets. I think one of the most important things about him is that he is much more a musician than a drummer. I mean, obviously he’s got mad skills, but he thinks in terms of the music as a whole, not just his own little part. He tailors his arrangements around what is going on in vocals, bass and guitars, which is generally a strength of the band, I think. We write in a back-and-forth environment where the arrangements of one instrument influences and is influenced by the arrangements of the others. But on Old Eyes, New Heart I think he really gets to show off his skills. There’s quite a lot of very interesting stuff going on in the drums but never in a way that interferes with the song.

Mads writes a lot, too. For instance, the verses on ‘Here And Now’ were originally a Mads guitar part. He’s quite a good acoustic guitarist and a really good singer.

Fun fact: One long standing Madder in-group gag, is trying to figure out how to make Mads play blast beats and sing very softly and beautifully at the same time.

 

Mads – photo by Camilla NessetKnut J. Berget

 

K: I also wanted to give BP his proverbial flowers regarding the production. This is the fourth album (Eight Wave, Red in Tooth and Claw, Marrow, Old Eyes, New Heat) that he has handled all production duties. You are not going to hear a better produced album in 2024, hands down. Everything is lush, organic, and perfectly balanced. And there are these subtle background noises in some of the songs that you can pick up while listening intently with headphones. Yet it’s not over-produced, that is, loses that ‘feel’. That is quite an accomplishment.

Agnete: I agree, very much. I mean, our music is absolutely not the easiest to produce. The contrasts are huge, as is the range of styles. It takes a very musical ear to create a production that works as well on the softness of the choruses on ‘Here And Now,’ as in the riffing madness of ‘Things I’ll Never Do.’ It’s such a hard job for BP. Imagine writing this music, rehearsing it, tracking your own contributions and everyone else’s, then sitting down to mix it. But I think there’s probably nobody else that could do it that perfectly for our music. So mega kudos to BP.

 

BP, photo by Camilla NessetKnut J. Berget

 

K: Let’s dive into the new album and go track by track.

‘Coming from the Dark’

We get right to the heart of the matter. No grandiose introduction or build. I found that an interesting way to start. The song itself feels structured almost as a prelude to the whole album. Lyrically I see a positive message about the band just doing what they do, comfortable with that and no delusions of grandeur of what’s to come from it.

Agnete: I think we all felt that this was the natural album opener. There’s something about the title, especially given the circumstances. Also, the idea of a punchy opener to set the mood. That interpretation of the lyrics has been suggested by others and I think it’s one that makes very much sense. But that wasn’t my point of view when writing it. For me, it’s about feeling that you have no value except for what you do – not feeling appreciated for who you are, only for what you can do and contribute for others, feeling invisible and nothing more than a productive tool or worker.

 

K: ‘On Guard’

Easily my favorite track, definitely in my all-time Top 5 of what you’ve done. I don’t view ‘Coming From the Dark’ as ‘punchy’ in the traditional sense, hence why I was expecting an even more up-tempo number. Nevertheless, you slow it down even more with a jazzy little nightclub number.

Then there’s this incredibly tasteful slide-bluesy Americana guitar solo (who gets credit for this?) that somehow fits perfectly in there and transitions beautifully back to your crooning. After you belt out your last vocal, I want people to listen to that subtle guitar lick and the background noise(s), it gives me chills. I’m taking a literal interpretation that you were hurt/rejected and that you want to throw yourself out there to someone, yet frightened by the prospect.

Agnete: Thank you! We’re very happy with the way it turned out. We were aiming for a weird blend of AC/DC, Alannah Myles, Leonard Cohen and Angelo Badalamenti and I think we pulled it off. I think we’ve gotten so much better at not overloading our arrangements, being much stricter with what we add on and that everything must support and contribute to the core feeling of the idea.

The label suggested a different track listing for the album, but we chose to go with our original idea, which I’m very happy about. One reason is that contrasts have always been a mainstay of what we do and that it kind of wakes people up. I think it also nicely presents you’ll have to expect a very wide range of styles.

The slide guitars are courtesy of former Madder guitarist Richard Wikstrand and I think he did an amazing job with it. He’s a real guitar hero that guy. Slide guitar is not for amateurs, and I think in this instance he manages to perfectly balance traditional slide-style references with Madder-compatible tonality. And I love singable, melodic solos.

But I also want to give a shout-out to BP and Anders’ guitar work in the background – it’s extremely tasteful and smoothly played, as well as amazingly well engineered sound-wise. Lyrically, that’s about 100 % right. This is also something I’m very satisfied with as a writer. I’m so happy with the structure, where the same elements are repeated with different contents. I also like how those images work together.

 

K: ‘Master Tongue’

Now we get to the full-on rage. I was going to say this is one of the more straight-forward songs on the album, but that doesn’t mean just one tempo straight on through for 4 minutes, MM doesn’t operate in that fashion. I love the interplay of Tormod and Mads on this as well. And I like that you somehow make groove metal ‘cool.’ I mean that in the sense that some of the extreme metal elitists thumb up their nose to almost all groove metal bands but BP seems to have cracked the code!

Agnete: The verse and riff on this is one of those ideas that we’ve worked on, on and off, for at least ten years, I think. We just never found the right setting or arrangement until now. I love how intense this song ended up. Did you pick up on the little Metallica tribute in the middle there? (MASTER, MASTER) There should also be some credit given to BP’s downstroke picking in the middle part, that’s not very easy to play.

About groove metal: It’s absurd to me that anyone would think that groove is a bad thing. But there was something about how nu-metal became very popular outside traditional metal scenes, which really irked the ‘metal-is-only-for-the-true’ people. We’ve had our fair share of reviews criticizing that we’re too groovy, which to me sounds like a compliment, to be honest. I remember one review long ago talking about our ‘one-noted riffs’ and I have to say I don’t think that reviewer had listened very well!

 

K: ‘The Head That Wears the Crown’

I am going to take a wild stab at this one and if I’m way off-base I won’t beat myself up over it. This addresses one of the main themes of Howl of the Underdogs: your struggle with weight, your perception of yourself and the guilt that you are holding the band back. At the same time, pushing back against that societal narrative while understanding that as a human being you need certain things from life. Not everything can be a constant battle/struggle and maybe The Law of Jante can be a safe space, at times.

Agnete: Ah, that’s an interesting interpretation. Honestly, that’s one of my favorite things about getting an album out, getting to hear how other people read and understand my lyrics. This was actually a simpler theme. It’s about trying to relate to someone who doesn’t really treat you like you deserve. You might stretch quite far to try to salvage the bond, but there are limits. And I guess in a way it’s me reminding myself who I am and what I will not accept or tolerate, even if it means severing a bond you’d rather keep. And I will beg for no one.

 

K: ‘Cold Hard Rain’

This is an interesting one. While nothing weird or bizarre musically, it took me much longer to get a feel for it than the rest of the album. It fits comfortably in its placement among the other songs, but it’s not littered with the typical Madder elements we’ve come to expect. I’m feeling the trials and tribulations that everyone goes through and how it’s easy for things to seem oppressive and bleak but ultimately triumphing over it and moving forward.

Agnete: The chorus here is also one of those ideas we’ve had around for years but never quite could solve until now. I’m extremely happy with how it turned out and how the production and arrangements on the verses makes the rain feeling really come through. In a generalized sense. It’s about depression, really. For some, it just eats away any kind of initiative or drive and just leaves a drawn-out, joyless existence.

 

K: ‘Unity’

I don’t have any massive insight into this one, and at the risk of ‘under-selling it’, a fairly straight-forward song talking about ‘let’s lock arms together and get the fuck out of my way’. Every album needs a song or two that isn’t overly thought provoking and intellectual.

Agnete: Haha, definitely agreed! I think the lyrics can be summed up as ‘either shit or get off the pot,’ to be a little crude. BP and Anders have invested a lot of time and money in new AxeFX digital amps and one cool thing about this song is that it really shows off some of the possibilities (with the arpeggiator stuff going on). It’s a very baroque build, in regard to what I said about Dad’s influence.

 

K: ‘Towers’

One of my favorite Madder songs ever, perfect one to release as the lead single back in November, pristine encapsulation of who and what the band are. Mads has this slightly off-kilter drum pattern going on. This is the second song on this album you drop an F bomb on, what’s going on with that?!?!?! Don’t get me wrong, I love me some Agnete profanity, makes me smile to hear it. The fact that it’s not commonplace helps to give it more impact.

Agnete: Haha, just finding my inner sweariness, I guess? I’ve always avoided it. I rarely swear when speaking English, much less than when I speak Norwegian, but it just felt right. This song is directed at somebody who has built such strong defensive walls that they’re incapable of letting anyone in. I really hate lukewarm-ness in general, and if someone isn’t willing to let you in on their weaknesses, you can never really know them. It takes all the colors to make a realistic image, maybe that’s one way to say it? In general, my lyrics tend to be more on the personal side. I tend to write about what feels closest.

 

K: ‘Here and Now’

I swear I didn’t have this grand plan to kiss Mads’ ass this much, but again the drumming on this one with that side stick he does, just amazing and fits so perfectly. Overall, a somber tone that reaches a crescendo and then it abruptly ends, clearly done on purpose. I’d say the lyrics speak for themselves on this one.

Agnete: Agreed – that groove is so clever, and yet quite understated. It really makes the song. We’ve sorted this under ‘Americana’, if you get the idea, with the folkish sound of the verses. Those choruses are a real bitch to sing technically because it needs to be so gentle. It sounds really awful if you’re just the teeniest bit out of pitch or get too heavy-handed. But I like how we landed the song. Yes, a very push-pull kind of almost-relationship that ended very badly.

 

K: ‘Things I’ll Never Do’

Musically this is a roller coaster, so I equated that to your emotional state being up one minute, down the next, especially considering the time period when it was written. The ending has an ominous and somber tone.

Agnete: All the sweet and gentle things in life. I wrote this as a final word at a point where I really saw no way forward at all. It’s still hard to sing.

 

K: ‘Long Road’

The album closer; gentle and delicate and the first time you have ended an album without a long, drawn-out epic. I’m again trying to put myself into your headspace. Dad was living with you and in poor health, yet it’s filled with such a sense of optimism. Based on everything you’ve expressed, this feels like a love letter to him.

Agnete: I don’t know… it just felt like there was no song that would fit after ‘Long Road’. It’s got a feel of summary and closure, in a way. And we also figured we might for once leave people in a more peaceful frame of mind than we usually do.

I remember very well how the idea for the verses came to me. It was some years ago, Dad had been very, very ill, in intensive care with his chronic obstructive lung disease and pneumonia. He pulled through after some very tense days and this idea came to me as I was driving back from the hospital. So, in many ways, it’s about Dad, though the lyrics were not necessarily written with only him in mind. It’s unusually hopeful for us, in some ways. We played an acoustic version of this at Dad’s funeral, so it’ll forever be his song. Another fun fact, this is also the song I’m working on a draft for at the end of the Howl documentary.

 

K: You are making me run for the tissues. Only happy tears of course.

Agnete: Haha, a good cry is just healthy.

 

K: For longtime fans of the band, they may have noticed this album title is ripped right from the lyrics of one of your best songs, “Blood on the Sand” (off Red in Tooth and Claw):

“Old Eyes to see for you
New Heart to bleed for you”

What made you feel the time was right or made it fit?

Agnete: Well, we were looking for a title beginning with ‘O.’

Mercury
All Flesh is Grass
Deadlands
Desiderata
Eight Ways
Red in Tooth and Claw
Marrow
Old Eyes, New Heart
R ???

I have always loved hiding these little easter egg references between albums and I think there’s at least one such on every album from Deadlands and onwards. A common theme for the album is change, turning and breaking points, cataclysms. The title carries all of that. We’ve thought in an A-side and B-side all along, so I like the duality. Feels like that’s where I am in life, too.

 

photo by Camilla NessetKnut J. Berget

 

K: We now come to the housekeeping portion of the interview where I groan at the prospect of having to ask ‘anything you care to share or let us know, show plans, etc.’ I get that it can be relevant and needed (to an extent) but I die a little bit inside when having to ask it!

Agnete: We’ve got a show coming up at the Inferno festival and then we’re booked for the 2024 ProgPower Europe. Apart from that, we’re working on setting up some weekend gigs here and there. Touring is more expensive than ever (post-pandemic), and family and work obligations also contribute to making touring difficult. I’d love to though, so if we get an opportunity that leaves us with food on the table and a roof over our heads, that would be amazing. Other than that, it’s hoping to get some good festivals. And of course, starting to write for the next album again.

 

K: I truly want to thank you for not only your time but your forthrightness. It’s been quite an adventure the last 4+ years and I’m honored that you shared this with us. We’ll have to make sure we speak in 2026 to mark the 20-year anniversary of our first interaction.

Agnete: Well, thank you for all your support! Things are looking up, both on a personal level and for the band, so let’s hope all the great feedback turns into something more solid. For myself, I’m trying to be more aware of what is good for me and making sure to spend my time on those things. It’s a funny thing about being in this business for so long, a lot of the people I speak to when we do interviews for an album, are people I’ve sort of known for years. This time around, it’s been truly heartwarming to feel the support and love coming through. A lot of people have responded with telling me their stories of losing someone near, and I don’t know, it just feels like connecting with people in a very real and true sense. Quoting myself is soooo pretentious but this is something I truly believe: ‘The roar of the emptiness dwindles away when it’s shared.’ It’s easy to forget, but human connection is one of the few good medicines when we’re scared and sad from staring into the realities of our short existence.

https://maddermortem.bandcamp.com/album/old-eyes-new-heart

https://darkessencerecords.no/artists/madder-mortem/

https://darkessence.indiemerch.com/

https://www.facebook.com/mmortem/

Line up:
Agnete M. Kirkevaag: Vocals
BP M. Kirkevaag: Guitar, vocals
Anders Langberg: Guitar
Tormod L. Moseng: Bass
Mads Solås: Drums